feminism and buffy: yay or nay?

Talk about the creator of Buffy, Angel and Firefly/Serenity.

feminism and buffy: yay or nay?

Postby drawingfool » Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:09 am

an interesting discussion here: http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com ... 7&st=12540


I didn't watch the show, but how would you fans intepret it? I think it could be they're reading too much into it, but most on the board said that Buffy and co started out as a powerful, well rounded characters and then became shallow.
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Postby Oz Rembrandt » Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:52 pm

Feminism and Strong Women are some of the biggest themes used in Buffy, and by Wheadon in general. That and absent fathers, which he seems to use in a lot of characters backgrounds.
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Postby drawingfool » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:37 am

Yeah, but if I may make a devil's advocate argument: many of the women in the series eventually turned evil and suffered consequences from having sex
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Postby Arran » Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:11 am

But if the characters, regardless of their sex, didn't turn evil or have bad things happen to them then there would be no drama. Buffy was certainly a "girl power" show, but it never rammed its feminist message down viewers throats.
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Postby Longines Symphonette » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:54 pm

drawingfool wrote:Yeah, but if I may make a devil's advocate argument: many of the women in the series eventually turned evil and suffered consequences from having sex


The girls had consequences from having sex? It was a man who would turn evil as soon as he had sex and experienced a moment of "true happiness". That's probably the worst consequence I can think of from a person having sex on "Buffy"(if we're talking strictly "BtVS" here and not getting into stuff that happened on "Angel"). A dude.

As for women turning evil...I don't really think that any of the ones who turned "evil" were actually truly evil. One was a case of being misguided and having a deep longing to belong and the only place she felt that was with the Big Bad. One was a case of extreme anger and hurt at the horrible and unexpected death of a lover. Not that that justifies her actions though.

Honestly though, I don't really view the Buffyverse as feminist or anti-feminist. I don't really think about that kind of stuff but that's mainly because I don't really care about feminism either way(I'm neither a feminist nor anti-feminism).

So yeah, I think the people on the TWOP forums might be reading a bit too much into certain aspects of the plot of these shows.

I mean, gosh, if you've watched the show you'll see that the male characters also have major flaws and bad things happen to them. None of the characters in "Buffy" and "Angel" are particularly lucky people. Male or female.
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Postby Sélavy » Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:51 pm

I second the above.

I kindof liked the show because it had strong women in them. But at the same time, men and women both are portrayed as strong and all of the characters have flaws. I'd say Mr Whedon (spelling??) truely gets feminism the way I see it; men and women are in a lot of ways the same and none is or better or worse then the other.
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Postby L'EnfantTerrible » Sat Jan 19, 2008 11:42 pm

Sélavy wrote:I second the above.

I kindof liked the show because it had strong women in them. But at the same time, men and women both are portrayed as strong and all of the characters have flaws. I'd say Mr Whedon (spelling??) truely gets feminism the way I see it; men and women are in a lot of ways the same and none is or better or worse then the other.


I like to put it in a similar fashion.

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